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WTC7.... the Final Verdict is in on 9/11
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Fintan
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2016 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gerrycan wrote:
".and no suspicious looking Frenchmen were spotted rigging for verinage"

Verinage wouldn't ever work on a steel frame.


True. Definitely not.
And neither could there be free fall with verinage.

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gerrycan



Joined: 01 Feb 2014
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fintan wrote:
gerrycan wrote:
".and no suspicious looking Frenchmen were spotted rigging for verinage"

Verinage wouldn't ever work on a steel frame.


True. Definitely not.
And neither could there be free fall with verinage.

Quote:


The bit right before column 79 fails is the bit that NIST really messed up. They said the girder was pushed off due to thermal expansion. The longest beam framing into it was 53ft - can't expand enough to fail it, and even if it could, the girder would be trapped by the column 79 west sideplate, as per structural drawing 9114. They also omitted stiffener plates and lateral beam supports.
Freefall is a great piece of evidence and very accessible to people, but in reality, NIST can't even make it that far. They can't get the first domino to fall.
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gerrycan



Joined: 01 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I forgot to add as well, that the girder had shear studs on it. These were also omitted by NIST. And from what I understand they may well have missed these out on over 35 floors of their model.
Recently uncovered finite element analysis carried out by ARUP confirms that there can be no failure as per NISTs hypothesis. this is also now confirmed by a published peer reviewed paper.
We are on record informing NIST of these issues and more over 4 years ago.
if I were a betting man I would wager that they may retract their hypothesis and issue an erratum in which they blame their FDS for the inaccuracies.
Here's a few of their omissions and errors, just from around this NE area near C79.
1/ Omitted 2 stiffener plates at girder end.
2/ Over estimated by over a factor of 2 the expansion of K3004 beam.
3/ Stated the seat plate width under the girder was 11" instead of 1 foot as per the structural drawings. This happened to fit in with their original claim that the girder was pushed 5.5" to failure. A claim they were forced to retract in an erratum.
4/ Omitted 3 lateral support beams clearly visible on floor framing plan E12/13
5/ Ignored the fact that the K3004 girder would expand in both directions and had about 1/2" or so to expand axially to the east. NIST took all expansion to be only to the west.
6/ Did not account for column sideplates WRT girder being trapped having axially expanded into the sideplate overhang.

I could go on. Keep in mind that this is the part of the building that NIST chose for their initiation hypothesis. They should have looked at the structural elements here closer than anywhere else.
What a tangled web.
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Big Boss



Joined: 04 May 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not really sure I'm liking the smell here lol....great job Fintan on the logical and scientifically tight responses...Looks like this topic was almost derailed....
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gerrycan



Joined: 01 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big Boss wrote:
Not really sure I'm liking the smell here lol....great job Fintan on the logical and scientifically tight responses...Looks like this topic was almost derailed....


Impossible to discuss NISTs WTC7 report without the reek of bullshit.
I hope you dont think i was derailing the topic with my verinage comment. I like the piece that the guy has written, it's just that bit. When I read that it was obvious that he was "reaching". Better to exclude it, and have it pointed out ina friendly way instead of some would be debunker making a strawman of it and attacking an otherwise excellent piece.
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Jimbo



Joined: 11 Mar 2008
Posts: 490

PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gerrycan wrote:
".and no suspicious looking Frenchmen were spotted rigging for verinage"

Verinage wouldn't ever work on a steel frame.


I thought this was a joke i wasn't getting about some French tight rope walker.
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psikeyhackr



Joined: 13 Oct 2007
Posts: 75

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So the issue is what is with our 'scientists' and 'engineering schools' for not resolving this in 2002?

The physics can never go away.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZT4BXIpdIdo

psik

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Big Boss



Joined: 04 May 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gerrycan wrote:
Big Boss wrote:
Not really sure I'm liking the smell here lol....great job Fintan on the logical and scientifically tight responses...Looks like this topic was almost derailed....


Impossible to discuss NISTs WTC7 report without the reek of bullshit.
I hope you dont think i was derailing the topic with my verinage comment. I like the piece that the guy has written, it's just that bit. When I read that it was obvious that he was "reaching". Better to exclude it, and have it pointed out ina friendly way instead of some would be debunker making a strawman of it and attacking an otherwise excellent piece.


Oh no Gerry, not at all. I meant the odd posts by Aemilius.
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