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How We Kicked Corporate Tobacco & Why
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Fintan
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2014 7:44 pm    Post subject: How We Kicked Corporate Tobacco & Why Reply with quote

Well, gosh... who'da'thunk'it!

Somewhat to my own surprise, I am now more than
10 days off tobacco and nicotine in any form.
Say...
Howz'abou'dat!

So, big deal. Why am I telling you?

Because of how I got off tobacco and nicotine. That's why I am telling you!

I didn't have a huge habit: somewhere between 5 and 10 cigarettes a day.


The Weird Bit:

I would break open regular cigarettes and re-roll them (lol). Weird or not,
the re-rolling meant that each cigarette made three small 'rollies'. So with
the tobacco going further and with the time it takes to roll, all this malarkey
slowed me from 20 a day to as little as 5 a day for the last five years.


The Lucky Bit:

I bump into my buddy, Eoin (Owen) and he hands me a pouch of something
called Pueblo Blue rolling tobacco.

"It's additive-free," he says. "But it's a lot milder than American Spirit,
which I found just too strong a smoke. I mix it with a herbal smoking
alternative called GreenGo on a ratio of about one part Pueblo to two
parts herbal."

Getting rid of the additives sounded like a nice bit of harm reduction,
so I began to use the Pueblo and took a small sample of the GreenGo.
The Pueblo tastes and smells great. Beautiful fine, mild golden virginia.


The Surprising Bit:

So, where's my addiction, dude? Y'see, when I smoke the additive-free
it's twice or three times as long before I even feel like another smoke!

So, where's my craving, dude? When I eventually want that next smoke,
it's only a "want". It's only a "desire". It's not a gimme-now "craving."

So, perhaps unsurprisingly my tobacco consumption begins slow decline.

Even before that decline, my symptoms from smoking were way down
compared to the chemical additive cigarettes: the Corporate tobacco.

I thought I was safe at a modest consumption of 7 a day on average.
But there is NO safe level of consumption for Corporate tobacco.




The Substitution Bit:

So, taking Eoin's hint, I started mixing the Pueblo with a herbal
mix called Honeyrose Special and the aforementioned GreenGo.

The Honeyrose Special is marshmallow leaves, red clover flowers, wild
lettuce and rose petals and is a smooth and soft smoke.

The GreenGo is a blend of hazel, papaya, mint and eucalyptus and it
very usefully has that hard-smokin' "edge" you get with tobacco.



Mixing these two and some tobacco, I was able to slowly substitute the
GreenGo for the tobacco - retaining a quite pleasant smoke which for
the last 10 days no longer has tobacco in the blend.


The Cold Turkey:
The withdrawal was not half as bad as I expected. In fact, for me the fire
went out of the addiction from the moment I quit chemical tobacco.

I could literally feel a certain tension leave my body as I came off the
Corporate tobacco chemical soup. My sleep improved, my skin lost a
slight puffiness which had been there... etc..

And I had the consolation that I was still smoking nicotine even as I did
the withdrawal from the chemicals. In fact, any need for the chemical
tobacco fades very quickly - so this part is not a problem.

At that point, you have at least cut in half the harm from tobacco.

I sprinted for the zero-nicotine line once I got to that point. I blended
the tobacco slowly out of my smoking mix. I still have much of the nice
relaxation buzz and taste that goes with a smoke.

But whether you take six days or six years to cut/and/or/skip nicotine,
in the meantime you will have saved yourself a heap of money and
eliminated most of the health risk.

Why have the additives not been removed from tobacco products?
Why has harm reduction been downplayed? Who benefits? Guess.



Products mentioned above are European, so we need to find comparable
US products. But I've listed the ingredients, and some of these are
available on ebay.

I will come back to help develop these issues more and I'm interested
if you folks found the same as I did and what worked for you.

Here's a sample from the interwebs:

Quote:
Anyone who has watched "The Insider" knows that nearly all of the big tobacco companies put over 1000 additives into their cigarettes and rolling tobaccos. These are to make the nicotine enter your system faster and make the tobacco burn faster. The whole concept is referred to as a "nicotine delivery system".

The past few years I have been buying one of the very small minority of cigarettes and rolling tobacco that says it is additive free. I only smoke about half a pack (10 cigarettes) a day anymore.

This past week due to many bills that hit at once I went a full week without anything to smoke. The past week I haven't had very intense cravings even to smoke besides a couple of times.....

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread576697/pg1

Quote:
"How could I ingest these cigarette poisons for 42 years, and have NO
CRAVINGS when I quit? How could this be possible?"

Although I received many supportive replies, no one really knew the
answer. My doctor couldn't answer the question, and was also mystified.

I think I stumbled across the answer this past weekend.

Background: For the last 10 years of my 42 year smoking habit,
I smoked American Spirit cigarettes......
http://quit-smoking-support.woofmang.com/viewtopic.php?t=5265


Quote:

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Last edited by Fintan on Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:29 am; edited 6 times in total
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kathy



Joined: 20 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I guess I might as well pop on here and say that through all of the above I have reduced my smoking of commercial cigarettes from 20 a day to 0 a day. I am smoking the tobacco Fintan mentioned in his post above, loosely rolled, about 5 a day and not inclined to want to smoke like I used to.

I have noticed a change in my gums, teeth, breathing and my voice and many similar changes as described above.

I have not noticed withdrawals or increase in appetite.

Kathy

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Continuity



Joined: 16 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 24, 2014 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eww - Honeyrose 'herbal tobacco' is *vile*! (IMNSHO) LOL! Smile

Personally, I've switched over to 'e-cigs', and have only bought tobacco once in the 6 months or so since I started with them, and that was early on when I ran out of 'juice'.

I make my own 'e-juice' now as well - it's *much* cheaper, and I have the pleasure of knowing what's going into it, although the majority of the commercial stuff is fine, as well.

All you need is some PG (Propylene Glyol - the stuff they use in fog machines at concerts etc) - you can get this from bakery suppliers or on special order from a pharmacy, some VG (Vegetable Glycerin - you can get this from the shelves at the chemists - it's used as a skin softener etc.) and Nicotene Concentrate (you can buy this online - 72mg/ml is the strongest you can buy here in the UK without a poisons license - it's 100mg/ml in the US, AFAIK).

It's *really* easy to mix your own - there are many on/offline apps to plug the numbers into that tell you exactly how much of each component to mix in. Put it this way - 35 of nic. conc. (250ml) is enough to make around 1 litre of 'juice' at the strength I vape it at (18mg/ml).! Smile I reckon I get through about 8ml per day, on average, so that's around 130 days vaping for around 50 of materials (plus the battery and clearomiser).

The advise I can give is to skip the 'cig-a-like'-type stage - i.e. the really thin ones that look like 'proper' cigs, and go straight to the decent ones, preferably with a selectable voltage battery - you can get something like this for around 20:



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Fintan
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent tips on the Vape approach, Continuity!

Your approach saves a holy fortune and yet you are still smoking nicotine!
Way to go! (I'm not an Anti-Nicotine Nazi Laughing)

Plus - by sourcing ingredients yourself, you are going the extra mile
to make sure that you know exactly what you are smoking.
That's the kind of mindfulness that pays off.

So, no One Size Fits All. Some use herbal, some vape, some both.

Key bottom lines:

    - Screw the "All or Nothing" absolutists. "Less" is good too.....

    - Dump the Big "Quit" approach. First learn to walk. Then run.....

    - Ditch Corporate chemical tobacco. Hint: Crack IS waay worse than Coke....


The chemicals in Corporate mass-market tobacco can cause symptoms
which people suffer from, but don't realize are due to the toxicity.


The big problem with the chemicals is that a chemical hypersensitivity
is the inevitable result of many years of tobacco chemical exposure.

The body's adaptive mechanisms to cope with the persistent low-level
chemical poisoning eventually run out of metabolic tricks for dealing
with the chemical onslaught. That's when significant side-effects can
become manifest.

And the further complication is that the hypersensitivity reactions
can be activated/aggravated by the merest trace of these chemical
additives.

So this acquired hypersensitivity means that for many people
there is NO safe level of exposure to the tobacco chemicals.

The effects of tobacco chemicals hypersensitivity include:

    - Acne
    - Gum disease / inflamed gums
    - Shrinking or expansion of the lower jaw
    - Painful, loose or twisted teeth
    - Mouth ulcers
    - Acid Re-flux / stomach ulcers
    - Sinusitis
    - Cough / Head colds / URTIs
    - Headaches / Brain fog
    - Peripheral neuropathies
    - Cancers of mouth / throat / lung

None of the above being driven principally by nicotine.

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They only function when open.


Last edited by Fintan on Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:44 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kathy



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's no like buttons on here Very Happy

I tried the cigarette type ones Continuity, still have two here, not as inclined to use them.

Still no Major (Brand) smoked here and no desire to either.


Very Happy

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Fintan
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 27, 2014 5:32 pm    Post subject: Marlboro Man 5 Has A Message For You Reply with quote

Marlboro Man #Five Has A Message For You

THIS ONE: "Donch'a just love Corporate Tobacco."

Surely a Five Strikes rule should apply? :

Quote:
Former Marlboro man Eric Lawson dies from smoking-related lung disease

Actor is the FIFTH 'Marlboro man' to die from a smoking-related illness
by HEATHER SAUL Monday 27 January 2014

Eric Lawson, the American actor who appeared as the rugged Marlboro man
in cigarette adverts during the 1970s and early 1980s, has died from lung
disease, aged 72.

Here's Eric, and he's looking
pretty damn cool @30 seconds:
Quote:

Did you realize that you too could be that cool
AND cut your 'Marlboro' risk by over two thirds!!?

So, don't be a dope.
Quit the toxic chemical Corporate Tobacco!
Smoke healthier tobacco fer cryin' out loud Laughing

In what other area of consumption would we all ignore such toxicity?
Think about that.
Would you eat chicken raised and sprayed with toxic chemicals?

We ignore the toxicity of the chemicals because:

- the Governments are not protecting the public,
- the health huts hate all tobacco anyway,
- harm reduction is not even on the radar
- and most important of all....

We ignore the toxicity of the tobacco chemicals because we have been
duped/propagandized/convinced that tobacco itself is the primary
cause of all tobacco-related morbidity and mortality.

THAT'S A LIE.
Think about that.
It's the least you can do.

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Fintan
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An update for us by email from Eoin
- who kicked this whole issue off:

Quote:
This documentary was definitely the tipping point on my road to
less corporate tobacco use, but I'm not sure where to see it now.

Their website:
http://www.AddictionIncorporated.com/


Here's a full Cspan interview with the maker and main man:

The video starts playing at the part from the Cspan
interview, about an additive which basically makes anything
else taken with it more addictive:



http://youtu.be/kUWYDjvLWWw?t=16m23s




I found that a part of this
great documentary IS online:





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cLSo4L7lqw




And some good
additional info:

Questions on Tobacco Additives
What goes into tobacco products?
How can tobacco products and their ingredients be assessed?
Does development of nicotine addiction depend on the dose?
Do additives make tobacco more addictive?
What else can enhance the addictiveness of tobacco products?
Do additives make tobacco more attractive?
What further research might be needed?

http://ec.europa.eu/health/scientific_committees/opinions_layman/tobacco/en/index.htm#1

Roll on,
Eoin

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Rumpl4skn



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always intended to research more thoroughly the internet story about Dr. Richard Doll, the British surgeon who made the definitive connection between tobacco and lung cancer, and the supposed fact that he began receiving a monthly stipend from Monsanto for about 1 year before his "discovery."
The inference being that perhaps it's not the tobacco that is carcinogenic, but the pesticides and other chemicals that Monsanto sprays on the plants.

Anyone have any news on that?

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Fintan
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I believe that added acetaldehyde is the key cancer vector
in tobacco use, along with tars and pesticide residuals from cultivation.

What come out clearly from the video above is that the lab rats ware
nine times as likely to seek an acetaldehyde/nicotine reward - compared
to a nicotine alone reward.

But they were also twice as likely to seek an acetaldehyde alone reward -
compared to a nicotine alone reward.

So what are we addicted to? Acetaldehyde, says the science.

Not just in the case of cigarettes, but also driving alcohol addiction!

So it's worth checking this:
Quote:
Acetaldehyde belongs to the larger chemical family of aldehydes,
which are pervasive environmental toxins. The human body possesses
enzymes that convert it to a less-harmful substance and therefore is
protected from small exposures. However, acetaldehyde at toxic levels can
make its way into the brain from sources such as alcohol consumption,
Candida sp. (yeast) overgrowth, breathing air contaminated with
acetaldehyde from cigarette and other smoke, smog, vehicle and factory
exhaust, synthetic fragrances and many commercially manufactured
materials
.

Acetaldehyde and its close relative formaldehyde are used in the synthesis
of chemicals such as plastics, dyes, fabrics, adhesives, fuels, plywood,
particleboard, insulating foam, fragrances, preservatives
and more.
Besides being an occupational hazard, these materials are found
throughout the home especially in new carpets, furniture and floors and
can out-gas aldehydes into the air for years, creating continuous exposure.
Aldehydes are among the top chemicals released into the
environment daily. http://rlu.ru/Kbw

Research shows that low dose chronic acetaldehyde exposure from
cigarettes
may be sufficient to gradually damage proteins, enzymes and
other cellular structures in the brain and other organs
.

Acetaldehyde is classified as a probable human carcinogen linked to nose
and throat irritation and cancer as well as a toxicant to the neurological
(neurotoxin), respiratory, endocrine and immune systems.

Acetaldehyde significantly compromises brain function.

It is considered to be the substance that directly contributes to the toxic
effects and the chemical dependency to alcohol and cigarettes.


Addictive, opiate-like biochemicals are formed in the brain when
acetaldehyde combines with the key neurotransmitters, dopamine and
serotonin.

Acetaldehyde and Nutrient Deficiencies

In addition to its toxic effects, acetaldehyde induces deficiencies of
nutrients used for its detoxification. As an example, vitamin B1
(thiamine) is depleted through alcohol and acetaldehyde detoxification.

Acetaldehyde-induced B1 depletions exacerbate the already low B1 levels
common in the population due to diuretics and other drugs, over-
consumption of simple carbohydrates (dysglycemia) and adrenal
stress.

Even mild, chronic B1 deficiency can produce brain-related symptoms such
as emotional instability, confusion, depression, fatigue, irritability,
headaches, sensitivity to noise, insomnia, decreased short-term memory,
brain-fog and a feeling of impending doom.

Supplementation with specific nutrients offers an important level of
prevention and protection from toxicity. In one animal study, cysteine
lowered in the digestive tract the amount of acetaldehyde produced by
smoking and alcohol consumption. Both of these risk factors are
considered the main causes of upper digestive tract cancer in 75%
of developed countries with acetaldehyde as the probable cause.

Symptoms of Acetaldehyde Poisoning :

Eye irritation
Nose irritation
Throat irritation
Conjunctivitis
Dermatitis
Light sensitive eyes
Tearing eyes
Bronchitis
Skin burns
Cough
Diarrhea
Nausea
Vomiting
Breathing difficulty
Red skin
Fluid in the lungs

High blood pressure - low level exposure
Rapid heart rate - low level exposure
Low blood pressure - high level exposure
Slowed heart rate - high level exposure

more information...

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Fintan
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, a few of the BFN readers/posters are
heading down the chemical-free route. Exclamation

Way to go.

So here's some of the no-additive sourcing options.

In UK:
You'll find Manitou/Pueblo at your local ASDA and online:
http://www.tobaccoonline.co.uk/Rolling-Tobacco/Manitou-Natural-RYO/

In Ireland:
Labeling and regulatory issues have kept the additive free brands off the
market in Ireland. And it sounds crazy but due to recent rule changes,
UK tobacco exporters can't take intl payments by credit card.

So, we've got a small private Manitou distribution system going.
Anyone else interested just msg me.

In USA/Canada:
The obvious American Spirit Natural is available online, but are
there any interstate issues and/or any keenly-priced sources?

Also, what about milder alternatives to American Spirit like the
Manitou/Pueblo available in EU? Or. is there a mild Am Sp?

In Australia/NewZeland:
I've no idea whatsoever on the supply down under.
The few sites have very high pricing.



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Fintan
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Well there's the good news Continuity.

Insignificant Acetaldehyde produced by the Vape products.
(Also the trace of Formaldehyde may be human in origin.)

Which makes vapes a pretty good harm reduction tactic.

And the additive-free route is great for people
who find the vapes simply don't cut it.

Meanwhile:
Quote:
Is acetaldehyde still being added to cigarettes?

DeNoble: They can successfully manipulate acetaldehyde simply by
adding sugars
. When you burn sugar, you form acetaldehyde. In fact, we
discovered that acetaldehyde increased the addictiveness of nicotine back
in 1982. It was from 82 to 86 that Philip Morris successfully added more
sugars to Marlboro cigarettes and Marlboro became the best-selling
cigarette in the world
.

The formulation for Marlboro hasnt changed.

http://www.examiner.com/article/director-charles-evans-jr-victor-denoble-talk-about-addiction-incorporated

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Last edited by Fintan on Fri Jan 31, 2014 7:04 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Fintan
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Quote:
Continuity: Eww - Honeyrose 'herbal tobacco' is *vile*! (IMNSHO) LOL! Smile

Actually, "vile" is being pretty generous!

I've smoked Honeyrose filter cigarettes ...and survived.....
The smell alone was truly evil. lol

But curiously the pouch Honeyrose works out if you dry out the
mostly marshmallow herb first! Put some on a candle-powered essential oil
tray (or in a warmed saucepan) for an hour to dry out. Neutral taste. Fine!

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